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  1. #11
    ClockWork12's Avatar
       ClockWork12 is offline Land Lubber
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    Re: What if KI just asks us for a monetary gift?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khione View Post
    This is getting a bit off-topic from the original post but wanted to drop some clarification towards this so we can get back on track (my comment on the actual threads main topic is after this):

    Crowfall is taking a long time because unlike most games that keep their inner pre-development (early Alpha and even pre-Alpha) stages under little public eye, they decided to be public from the very start. Every game usually begins development with a team/company around 1-2 years in advance for large scale projects like Crowfall. Just look at Nintendo's Gamefreak Pokemon franchise, back when Sun and Moon was announced we already were told the game coming out even after that was already in early phases which was about 2 years ago! In comparison to the amount of stuff that it takes with starting up a company from the ground up, I think you can piece together why Crowfall is still yet even in public beta. Another example of a game doing something similar to Crowfall is "The Bazaar" by a Hearthstone E-sports org owner (Tempostorm's Reynad) which hasn't even shown gameplay yet they announced and asked for kickstarters over a year ago and they still don't plan to have any playable demo until early 2020 or end of this year at earliest.

    Ok so with that little topic answered let me give my 2 cents on the original topic;

    Honestly, it depends on how they go about it. If at this point they just slap together a kickstarter type thing with no rewards or not even something monetarily valuable for giving them the money to do something that shouldn't be required and is only required because they dug themselves into this hole, no. I would rather let the game die then for them to revive it off the back of us doing their budgeting for them. We're not your accountant, sorry. Now if like one person pointed out had a bundle type deal like the beta-bundle for the swashbuckling cat type of deal, absolutely. One of the things I was happy about was that I got the boochbeard bundle (iirc was the name) not only got me hyped about the game but also I felt like I wasn't just tossing out money with no benefit. However, like I said. This shouldn't be required, even if they're dipping into money earned from Wizard101, they put themselves in this hole to begin with. Why should we the playerbase who have done everything from handing them a ladder to carrying them up it for the last 5+ years be obligated to now be their accountants, sponsors and shareholders. Its just a bad look. The only way I could see it working that way is if it was a small pledge type of deal, everyone puts in no more than 10$ and it gets done. At this point, KI needs to cut their losses somewhere and either dip into their Wiz savings account that they been focussed so dearly on to try to make Pirates have an actual future. Or it will just be a repeat, we get a "book 15" of like 3 hours of gameplay then they're like "that's good enough for the next 3 years, oh and make sure to save up to give us another 100$ to make another one. You don't need that new Pokemon game instead right?". Nope, I'm buying Pokemon Whatever and Whatsoever instead because all it makes me wonder is, where is the well over $1,000 I've spent on the lifetime I've played this game gone already as well as the countless others? The reality is, keeping up a server doesn't cost that much. Mostly when it's shared with the Wizard101 server anyway which definitely makes more than profit. It has to have gone somewhere and clearly it HAS NOT been put to good use. So how can I trust this company that has been blatently lying to us for so long on many accounts. They can't even be transparent about the simplist stuff. It's heartbreaking to say all this, but being controlled and mannered about it isn't going to get anywhere anymore. If the company wants to keep going the "we're totally working on something (but not really we just dont care and will lie to you upfront about it)" approach then that's fine, I'll just do the ol' fashion let me go play a game run by a company that actually cares about their game and wants to constantly improve it and make money off of actual good content rather then sucking our players dry and thinking about the rest after.
    on the Crowfall fair enough , but keep in mind its been 5 , 6 and i can't remember how many years since they first started . I stopped following the development years ago and don't even remember when they started and personally i have no issue with it but many ppl have made videos on the subject labeling the project as a failure which is what i was echoing to.I considered my 120 dollar kick starter contribution as a loss and moved on years ago.
    Last edited by ClockWork12; 08-16-2019 at 10:18 PM.
    P101 Eric West/W101C Jeremy5511



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  3. #12
    GoldenGuardian's Avatar
       GoldenGuardian is offline Rookie
    My Pirate101 Character is a Swashbuckler

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      •  Dread-Admiral Hawkins
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    Re: What if KI just asks us for a monetary gift?

    So the main arguments of this thread are
    i) how much money does KI need to make a new pirate101 world,
    ii) how many people are willing to donate.

    Lets break this down, how expensive is everything?

    ASSUMPTION: If it takes 3 months for a w101 world, I feel it would take 4 months for a p101 world (just cause they care about us less).

    NOTE: TAKE EVERYTHING, I mean EVERYTHING, i say in down below in this reply with extremely loose regard. I know nothing too much. If someone has official, credible, verifiable stats, probably listen to them instead. A lot of below is based on random assumptions, and i pull things out of the air (i.e 30% of total staff work on a project) with no proper reasoning- it just felt like a "reasonable figure" for me.


    WAGE COSTS:
    A quick google search says there are ~135 employees in KI (again, take this loosely, this is likely outdated). Assume, just for example, that they allocate 30% of staff to solely work on this p101 update for 5 months.

    Also according to the site payscale, KI pays its employees on average $75, 298 a year. Note this could be an outdated statistic. Further note that for the 30% of staff we included in our assumption, that they may comprise of highly skilled and well payed software engineers and the like, making the average wage for this project of world building perhaps higher, around $80 000.

    Now lets math.

    30% of 135 is ~40.

    40 x 80 000 = $3 200 000.

    Since it is 4 months of wages, we take 33% of this figure.

    This is approximately $1 060 000. oof.

    ADDITIONAL COSTS:

    Server costs maybe $5000, and additional random MISC costs maybe up to $35 000.

    We are approx up to $1 100 000

    PRE-EXISTING ASSETS:

    KI has a lot of concepts and new worlds and designs already built, but they did nothing with them so far. We have seen images of krok and stuff in development. Since they are not starting from scratch, maybe subtract 100 000.

    We are approx up to $1 000 000, aka one million dollars for new world.

    TOTAL COSTS:

    So probably around $1 000 000 on average for a new world, as an estimate??? I am inclined to say that this average is perhaps slightly right skewed, so I expect anywhere between the likes of $600 000 - $1 500 000 for a new world.

    NOW WHAT?

    Soooo now we need to fund a project that could be very expensive. With 350 of us, we would EACH have to pay on average somewhere between $1714 [if new worlds cost 600k] to $4300 [if they cost 1.5m], or $2800 [if we stick with with my 1m assumption]. These number will obviously reduce with more people joining.

    TL;DR:

    - A new world could cost anywhere between $600 000 to $1 500 000
    - With 350 people, that means each of these people need to pay somewhere between $1700 - $4300
    - If more people join, each person pays less
    - Take whatever I have said very loosely and don't treat it as fact.
    - Making new worlds is expensive. VERY expensive.
    Last edited by GoldenGuardian; 08-16-2019 at 11:10 PM. Reason: math





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  5. #13
    GoldenGuardian's Avatar
       GoldenGuardian is offline Rookie
    My Pirate101 Character is a Swashbuckler

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      •  Dread-Admiral Hawkins
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    Re: What if KI just asks us for a monetary gift?

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenGuardian View Post
    So the main arguments of this thread are
    i) how much money does KI need to make a new pirate101 world,
    ii) how many people are willing to donate.

    Lets break this down, how expensive is everything?

    .
    .
    .
    TL;DR:

    - A new world could cost anywhere between $600 000 to $1 500 000
    - With 350 people, that means each of these people need to pay somewhere between $1700 - $4300
    - If more people join, each person pays less
    - Take whatever I have said very loosely and don't treat it as fact.
    - Making new worlds is expensive. VERY expensive.
    Ok, after giving it some thought, and looking at how much money WoW makes (and thats a lot), i feel like the cost of a new world maybe more than even $1 500 000.

    For me the price of one year membership is $80, but i believe this is in AUD. In USD this is $55, which I think is correct (someone let me know)

    If 80 000 p101 players buy a one year membership (which I assume has happened) that would generate nearly 4.5m (80 000 x 55 = $4 400 000)!!!!!!!!

    Pirate101 did boast about having 1m players once, but idk how many players were even paying players, or for the matter, active players.

    Surely 4.5m is enough to make a new world, unless mr ceo decided to invest in mobile gaming.





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  7. #14
    Varys's Avatar
       Varys is offline Land Lubber
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    Re: What if KI just asks us for a monetary gift?

    That breakdown assumes a large content update with a new world made from scratch alongside new mechanics. KI is in a privileged position where not only do they have vast amounts of art assets able to be repurposed, but the core player base doesn't mind when they do this. They could've pushed out a world by now with just a skeleton crew, but whatever they had previously in development was almost certainly scrapped or reused for W101, particularly Polaris and Empyrea.



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